Alien E5

What is the typical milling time for a single unit crown?

We average 14-18 mins per crown

Dear Sirs, This is to inquire some info on the VHF milling machines. I have been a customer; I have been using your services for milling. In general, I got 2 years ago a dry mill, the Roland, from another reseller, unfortunately it has been a very bad experience, it does not work, it keeps failing to calibrate, the re-seller cannot help, they passed me on to the manufacturer who does not respond back, and they do not do on-site repairs/maintenance. So, I am looking for another option, but based on the previous bad experience I have been very cautious to avoid having similar problems. I saw there is a new E5 VHF, and you have been having the R5 for some time now. Can you please go over my preliminary questions, please take your time so I get the right answers: 1. In general, if I buy one of those milling machines, or both, I see for 2K you do in-office installation. We need that, but mostly we need training on the CAM software and how to use the machine. This is provided with the in-office visit, correct? The technician is not only installing the unit but also show how to work with the CAM software, correct? 2. Is 1-day in-office training enough for us to use the machine? Is it enough so we can work with the CAM software? For a dentist and his assistants who never used this CAM software before. 3. I assume if we need additional training, like 1-day full remote training on CAM software, it is 2K in-person per day, correct? and I remember you saying $500 per day remote training, correct? 4. SOS: While we use the machine, there will be questions. We will need support. “How do I do this, how do I do that?” Is support included? Do you charge for support? Do you have a dedicated phone number and people for support? 5. For the R5, is this meant to be used by labs or dentists? Is it too complicated for dentists who are not so specialized in those? 6. I understand they come with their own CAM software, correct? Is this included? Most important, are there annual updates? Are they included or is there a fee for the updates? 7. The R5 can mill anything, however, the spindle has 800 Watts. Compared to imes-icore or the Versamill it is too low, those have around 3,000 Watts. Is this too low for metal bars? Have you been using the R5 for metal bars a lot? 8. Down the road, if/when those machines have an issue, and they go bad, like it happened to me with the Roland, how do you support? Is an in-office repair/maintenance an option? By you or the manufacturer? Cost for this? Is the manufacture willing to come if needed to repair if/when you cannot do so? 9. May I ask how many R5 have you sold to dentists? Anybody with regrets/complaints? May I have a list of some of those dentists for me to call and ask them? 10. The E5 says “implant bars” to mill. This is a dry mill, so how can it mill bars? Don’t you need a wet milling for this? And when it says metal bars, does it mean Titanium blanks 98mm? 11. For both machines, there is no C-clamp. The VHF website says “C-clamp in progress”. So, I assume you cannot testify for the E5, since it is new, but can the R5 mill well a full arch all-on-X without a C-clamp? 12. Important question: Considering there is no C-clamp, can these mills specifically mill a direct to MUA full arch prosthesis? Since the E5 is new you probably cannot tell, but for the R5, is it reliable for full arch direct to MUA design (when designing direct to MUA the abutment channels are longer, some mills may have difficulties)? 13. The R-5, can it mill wet a PMMA? My understanding is that PMMA can be milled either way, wet or dry, but wet is better. So, do I get to choose wet vs dry when I mill PMMA? 14. Same question for the Ivotion denture, can it mill it wet? The new E5 can also mill denture, correct? 15. The R-5 is either wet or dry. But how really feasible is this? Some people say no big deal to switch from wet to dry, some other say to use it only as wet and have another one as dry. What is your experience? 16. I like the non-compressor concept of E5. Is the new R5 coming up? An all-you can mill machine like the R5 but with no need for compressor by implementing the non-compressor concept? 17. There is an “Ivotion kit” option on the web-site for the E5. What is this kit? What does it include? 18. On the web-site there is an option for a desktop computer to be purchased. What brand/model is it? I am mostly inquiring on the brand, DELL is perfect; if it is HP then we are not interested, we had bad experience with HP 19. “E5 block holder” option on the website. What is this option? I hope I did not have too many questions. My big picture is to get the E5 first once they come-up with a C-clamp and assuming it can 100% mill full arch cases with direct to MUA design. If and when I am happy with this machine, the support, the functionality, and everything, then I buy additionally the R5 (or its successor). I am in no hurry my priority is to now make the right choice. Thank you,

1. In general, if I buy one of those milling machines, or both, I see for 2K you do in-office installation. We need that, but mostly we need training on the CAM software and how to use the machine. This is provided with the in-office visit, correct? The technician is not only installing the unit but also show how to work with the CAM software, correct? 

This is Correct 

2. Is 1-day in-office training enough for us to use the machine? Is it enough so we can work with the CAM software? For a dentist and his assistants who never used this CAM software before. 

One day is enough to get basic operation. Milling, Calibrating, and Cleaning. 

3. I assume if we need additional training, like 1-day full remote training on CAM software, it is 2K in-person per day, correct? and I remember you saying $500 per day remote training, correct? 

$2k for in person, and $500 for remote. 

4. SOS: While we use the machine, there will be questions. We will need support. “How do I do this, how do I do that?” Is support included? Do you charge for support? Do you have a dedicated phone number and people for support? 

We do not charge for support as of 5/8/23, but support plans are in the works, for future purchase. 

5. For the R5, is this meant to be used by labs or dentists? Is it too complicated for dentists who are not so specialized in those? 

It is a "Fully Loaded" machine, so in essence will be a bit more complicated. 

6. I understand they come with their own CAM software, correct? Is this included? Most important, are there annual updates? Are they included or is there a fee for the updates? 

The Cam software is included. Normally VHF pushes updates for free. However, the last update from ver 7 to ver 8 (Major Update) did come with a upgrade fee. 

7. The R5 can mill anything, however, the spindle has 800 Watts. Compared to imes-icore or the Versamill it is too low, those have around 3,000 Watts. Is this too low for metal bars? Have you been using the R5 for metal bars a lot? 

According to VHF it can mill Titanium Bars. We do not use the R5 for milling bars at our facility. 

8. Down the road, if/when those machines have an issue, and they go bad, like it happened to me with the Roland, how do you support? Is an in-office repair/maintenance an option? By you or the manufacturer? Cost for this? Is the manufacture willing to come if needed to repair if/when you cannot do so? 

If the problem can be solved remotley, with help from your staff, Alien Milling will be your support. If the problem is mechanical, then the machine will need to be shipped to VHF. Cost of repairs, and shipping will be charged to the customer. 

9. May I ask how many R5 have you sold to dentists? Anybody with regrets/complaints? May I have a list of some of those dentists for me to call and ask them? 

This is confidential. 

10. The E5 says “implant bars” to mill. This is a dry mill, so how can it mill bars? Don’t you need a wet milling for this? And when it says metal bars, does it mean Titanium blanks 98mm? 

The description was copied from VHf, I assume they mean tri-lor or zirconia material. 

11. For both machines, there is no C-clamp. The VHF website says “C-clamp in progress”. So, I assume you cannot testify for the E5, since it is new, but can the R5 mill well a full arch all-on-X without a C-clamp? 

Yes, it has a great degree of freedom. 

12. Important question: Considering there is no C-clamp, can these mills specifically mill a direct to MUA full arch prosthesis? Since the E5 is new you probably cannot tell, but for the R5, is it reliable for full arch direct to MUA design (when designing direct to MUA the abutment channels are longer, some mills may have difficulties)? 

Normally the limit is around 14mm for direct to mua. This is true for most mills, because of the tool lenght. 

13. The R-5, can it mill wet a PMMA? My understanding is that PMMA can be milled either way, wet or dry, but wet is better. So, do I get to choose wet vs dry when I mill PMMA? 

We have not tried milling PMMA wet. 

14. Same question for the Ivotion denture, can it mill it wet? The new E5 can also mill denture, correct? 

Again, we mill dry. The E5 can mill ivotion. 

15. The R-5 is either wet or dry. But how really feasible is this? Some people say no big deal to switch from wet to dry, some other say to use it only as wet and have another one as dry. What is your experience? 

We do not like to mix wet and dry milling. Once we dedicate a machine for a certian material, we keep it that way. 

16. I like the non-compressor concept of E5. Is the new R5 coming up? An all-you can mill machine like the R5 but with no need for compressor by implementing the non-compressor concept? 

No words. 

17. There is an “Ivotion kit” option on the web-site for the E5. What is this kit? What does it include? 

It include the holder and tools for the Ivotion. 

18. On the web-site there is an option for a desktop computer to be purchased. What brand/model is it? I am mostly inquiring on the brand, DELL is perfect; if it is HP then we are not interested, we had bad experience with HP 

It will be computer that meets or exceeds the minimum requiremens. I would suggest you purchase a PC of your choosing, and opt out of that on the site. 

19. “E5 block holder” option on the website. What is this option? I hope I did not have too many questions. My big picture is to get the E5 first once they come-up with a C-clamp and assuming it can 100% mill full arch cases with direct to MUA design. If and when I am happy with this machine, the support, the functionality, and everything, then I buy additionally the R5 (or its successor). I am in no hurry my priority is to now make the right choice. 

The E5 Block holder is for unsintered Zirconia, and PMMA.

does the e5 take a premilled titanium blank to make a custom abutment?

No only, 

• Zr, Composite ,
  
  PMMA, CrCo Materials

what program is used to figure out margins and crown shape to mill - I have a fastmill -IO that does bridges upto 3 teeth; but I have patients that need 5 teeth bridges and so forth

The E5 uses VHF Cam 8 to nest and mill crowns. 
The E5 takes a 98mm dics that is capable of milling up to Full Arch Hybrids.